Fall ball is mostly wrapped up around the country, and it taught us a few things about some of the teams in the state of Michigan.
Detroit
Results: Detroit 7, Denison 10
The Detroit/Denison scrimmage
The result of the game tells us a little bit about Detroit: they don’t have the depth to continue having their recent run of success (albeit a run of success that lasted the second half of one season – one win away from the NCAA Tournament is impressive nonetheless) if they have many starters go down.
Their top line players – particularly guys like Adams, Tim Lehto, and AJ Levell, none of whom played against Denison – obviously have the talent to get to the cusp of the NCAA Tournament. Add in a guy like Joel Matthews (a star in 2010 who didn’t play last year or in the Denison scrimmage), and they’ve even added to it. However, the team isn’t deep enough to handle any significant losses due to injury.
Playing deep into the bench showed that, at least in the fall, some of the depth players aren’t nearly to the level to step up and take key roles this spring. That shouldn’t be an issue during the regular season, as long as the Titans can stay healthy.
Michigan
Results: Michigan 10, Providence 11 (OT)
Michigan 5, St. Joseph’s 9
Michigan 2, Towson 15
The Wolverines had a lot more question marks going into fall ball. Unlike Detroit, they’d never before been a D-1 team, and had to show that they belong on that level. The earliest indication, an overtime loss to Providence, seemed to indicate that they were. Aside from some unforced errors, they played competitively with the Friars.
After that, however, things didn’t go so well. The Wolverines showed that they have a long way to go before they’ll be able to compete with the big boys. Most reports out of the Nick Colleluori Classic mentioned sloppy play, poor defense, and the Wolverines simply not being ready to play on the D-1 level.
Michigan started further back than every other Division-1 team, so they also have a chance to make more rapid progress than any other team at the level. Like Detroit, they don’t have the depth of teams that are recruiting All-Americans year-in and year-out, and in fact probably have even less (the Titans have had a few years of recruiting to build a roster), but their players could come on until the spring.
The coaches are installing new systems on each side of the ball, and once the players have a better understanding, they should be able to take a step forward. Still, this roster is a little further behind than I was expecting, and barring massive improvement, it should be a tough first year in Ann Arbor.
MCLA
As little as fall ball tells us about NCAA teams (which is little indeed), I think we know even less about MCLA teams. There are more variables in terms of roster turnover, disparities in competition faced, etc.
Grand Valley State again looks like a superpower in MCLA-2, as does cross-town rival Davenport. The CCLA-2 is strong as ever.
Michigan State only scrimmaged MCLA-2 Dayton (as far as I can tell), but looked solid. We didn’t learn a whole lot about the Spartans, from my understanding.
Central Michigan and Western Michigan are both looking to take the next step in the CCLA-1 with Michigan’s departure to the NCAA, and it sounds like Central has some work to do before the spring.
Any reports I missed? Feel free to share them in the comments, and as always you can reach me on Twitter @GreatLaxState or via e-mail at t.w.sullivan1@gmail.com.
Detroit should be better this year if they stay healthy and eligible. Getting Matthews back is huge.
Michigan will be fortunate to win 3 or 4 games. That would be huge. They will get better than they were in the fall, but they don’t have a lot of D1 talent yet.
MSU, with UM gone, will dominate the CCLA. They need to get out of the first round of the MCLA tournament though.
The Spartans have really disappointed in the MCLA Tournament, no doubt. I wonder if Michigan’s departure will have a positive or negative effect on the team short-term.
My guess is negative. MSU was able to play great home games because top 20 teams wanted to come out to the midwest to play Michigan, and they piggybacked on that. With UM gone it will be tough for MSU to get quality home games. They need to play great teams to get tournament ready.
It’s actually a positive because, while they won’t have the turnouts because the rivalry won’t be there anymore, MSU might not me in the MCLA much longer as well 🙂
Why would MSU not be in the MCLA? They are NOT going D1 any time soon.
I wish D1 were true, but unless you have information I don’t, it’s not likely in the immediate future. MSU’s AD said over the summer that he wouldn’t put forth any funds to do so.
Michigan got real lucky. Brandon is paying for the women’s team and donations paid for a majority of the men’s program. In MSU’s case the donation would need to cover BOTH.
Donations paid for the a couple of years of operating budget for the men’s team. They aren’t paying for it after those first couple of years, and they aren’t paying for facilities. It’s not luck. It’s an athletic department that practically prints money, whether it’s through football, donations or sponsorships. There are only a handful of those. MSU is not one of them. They, like most athletic departments, lose money. Hollis said he wouldn’t be spending any funds on lacrosse because he doesn’t have those funds.
I think on UDM it could have been a lot shorter.
What did we learn? Nothing. 4 quarters of the 12 quarters they were supposed to play at an event don’t tell us a damn thing. We’ll wait until spring.
What we’ve learned is that despite UDM’s head start, the Wolverines and Titans could very well be a lot closer in ability than some people think. Both teams were missing players in Fall Ball, so when trying to compare the scrimmage results, it’s somewhat of a wash.
Remember, Michigan is a national name (academically as well as athletically), that previously had a high level (club) team, and is located in one of the top college towns in the country. On the other hand, UDM is a local school that is located in a somewhat challenged area, and they started their program from scratch.
Bottom line, UDM has more D1 playing experience while Michigan (already) draws players with a better lacrosse pedigree.
I would love to understand how you can draw a parralell that states that UM and UDM are close in skill level from these two fall ball results. Especially when UDM played their first line midfield in the game for one shift and ran through their entire roster.
UDM has seemed to move out of the bottom cellar and have a chance to make the NCAA tournament this year through the MAAC.
Obviously, Michigan is going to pull big name recruits, and it’s more than likely just a matter of time until Michigan is much better than Detroit. But that, my friend, is in 4 years at best. (One true recruiting class) 14-3 Detroit. Calling it.
Anon, just so you’re aware of the ‘gravity’ of your prediction…
A 14-3 win by UDM over Michigan would potentially make the Titans a mid-level team (on par with the likes of Dartmouth and Rutgers) in only their fourth season of competition. That would be a historic accomplishment by NCAA standards.
I’d rather have an eligible Joel Matthews, a healthy Shayne Adams, Jordan Houtby and Jamie Hebden than any recruit Michigan has landed.
How about Will Meter? Hebden and Meter are both from Rice and Meter got Mr. Lacrosse. I havent seen Hebden play since high school, so I cant really compare them myself, but I certainly think Meter would be comparable at least.
Not trying to disrespect Hebden, I’ve heard great things, just not sure I would be so quick to write some guys off.
Hebden was 5th in the nation for caused turnovers in 2011 as a sophomore.
Really Anon? ANY recruit? More than guys like King, Shanks and Zonino in their 2013 class or Jackson, Gaughan or Lott in the 2012 class? How can you make that judgement? Have you seen all of the UM recruits play? I can’t tell you one way or the other since I haven’t seen any of them except Kennedy and Walker, who are both pretty good but not nearly the highest ranked recruits they have landed. The UDM guys you listed are really good. No question. But I have no frame of reference to compare them to the guys Michigan will be bringing in. That answer will come eventually.
I agree that UM is way behind UDM right now but will pass them soon. I think 4 years at the outside. Their recruiting is already starting to show their potential. Obviously their facilities, budget, national reputation and other intangibles make it a great situation to succeed. But I’m not going to comment on their recruits until I’ve seen them, except to say I’m excited to see if some of them live up to what is out there about them.
None of this is a knock on UDM by the way. I support what they are doing. They have already accomplished more than I ever thought they could given all they have to overcome. Four years in and they are already challenging for MAAC titles. I’m proud that they are in Michigan.
Anon, without reading too much into Fall Ball, Michigan playing competitively against lower level D1 competition (of which UDM is also considered) is generally comparable to UDM playing competitively against an upper level D3 team.
Furthermore, your characterization of UDM “having moved out of the bottom cellar” is overly generous at best. To be completely honest, the MAAC is a very weak conference whose best team (Siena) typically gets crushed in the first round of the NCAA tournament.
Agreed. It would be great for the great-lax-state if UDM can take the next step and crack the middle D1 tier, but I don’t know if they are there just yet based on fall results. We will see this spring. Winning the MAAC and getting a tourney birth would be HUGE. I hope they can pull that off.
Maybe in a few years we could have grand valley win mcla d2, MSU win mcla d1, UDM win the MAAC and an ECAC competitive Michigan team.