First up, over at my (soon-to-be former) place of employ, an interview with Inside Lacrosse Managing Editor Terry Foy about Michigan’s entry into the world of D-1 Lacrosse:
As a John Paul proponent, I think he’s a viable long-term solution because he’s shown himself to be smart and adaptable to this point in his career as a college lacrosse coach. Without having faced the challenge of coaching against a DI schedule with a DI team, it’s impossible to say with any certainty how he and his staff will fare record-wise, and there’s an argument that their MCLA success isn’t the best predictor. However, it’s my opinion that winning lacrosse games is easier than taking an MCLA team at an FBS school to the varsity level in this fiscal and political climate, so if the skillset that allowed him to do that translates even halfway to on-field motivation and strategy, he’s more than capable of producing the type of results I laid out above.
That quote will surely satisfy a certain commenter who insists JP isn’t cut out for the job. Click through for much, much more (to the tune of 1500 words).
UDM women’s lax earned academic honors this spring from the IWLCA.
Surprise! lacrosse is one of the fastest-growing high school sports in America. And by “surprise” I meant “no surprise at all.”
I think its funny how he agrees with me. He says exactly what I said, that winning club lacrosse is not an indication how you will do in DI or coaching DI kids. He talks about the roster of kids on the current club team and how the top players don’t stack up to DI talent, there are no high profile transfers or recruits for 2012 and the 2013 class is nothing exciting relative to DI talent. He also says most DI coaches don’t even have a read on the MI coach because he has been irrelevant coaching a club team.
The current scenario is a perfect storm for some serious routs in 2012 and 2013. So the coach is a great salesman getting the AD to go DI and then selling his skill set as something that can transfer to the DI ranks to the AD, but now he will have to deliver. We will see how the AD feels after 2014. By the way the managing editor of inside lacrosse didn’t gush over the future prospect for the program and he is not going to piss all over potential readers from Michigan or UM fans. If you haven’t noticed there is recession going on and he going to be diplomatic because he wants as many people as he can get to subscribe to his website/magazine and MI going DI is a great story. I wasn’t the one who was going on and on about the new program winning right away, winning conference titles and making the NCAAs in the first year. That was all your fairy tale crap you put up. I would love to see UM lax be successful for the game, but I am not living in fantasy world with the roster of players they will have in the next few years and the unproven coaching staff.
“That was all the fairy tale crap you put up.”
???
Just a cursory search of the posts on this blog reveals the following tidbits:
“In three or four years when Michigan’s first few recruiting classes grow up and the program takes their share of lumps, the roster will have turned over with blue-chip lacrosse players from around the country that can roll with the speed and physicality of the Division I game.” – Inside Lacrosse’s Ryan Rabidou
Tim’s response: “Obviously”
“That said, they won’t be world-beaters either. Nobody on Michigan’s club team has lost more than two games in their college careers, and they’ll definitely be taught a lesson in humility. For Michigan’s purposes, it is more important to get exposure for the program and lay a foundation for the future than run up a gaudy record in year 1.” – Tim
The consensus here and elsewhere I think has always been that Michigan will struggle to hit .500 the first year or two. They will struggle to get anyone in the first three classes who chose Michigan over Syracuse and Hopkins. And they will need at least 3-4 years to start making noise in the ECAC and challenging (presumably) Denver for the auto-bid to the big dance. I don’t think that prognosis is a fairy tale or a fantasy world.
We have three young coaches, two unproven at this level but a third who is probably the hottest name in offensive coordinators at this time. We have a great academic school with a magnetic pull for east coast prep schoolers. Michigan is poised to become successful very quickly in D1 lacrosse. Not the first year, not the second, and not the third, but look for UM to be making noise at the nat’l tourney within ten.
Quit trolling.
I wouldn’t call JP young. He’s in his 40’s.
I think Foy’s analysis is pretty accurate. I don’t know of too many people who believe that UM is going to knock it out of the park in the first few years. That’s not realistic or fair. They don’t even have lacrosse facilities built yet. Everything I’ve seen from JP has indicated that he anticipates it’s going to be tough. He’s not out there saying they are going to tear it up quickly. But on the other hand he can’t be out there publicly saying “we’re going to get handled.” That wouldn’t be a very good recruiting pitch.
As for recruiting, they got started way too late to make a major impact on the 2012 and 2013 classes. For all we know they had a ton of transfer interest (I assume they did) but couldn’t get anyone in so late. JP wasn’t even hired until late May, and Lattimore came on board around the start of July. 2014 is their first chance at a blue chip class. Over the next few months their facilities plans will start to become public, which will help a lot. Over the next couple of years they will probably start landing high impact level recruits. It’s easy to sit back and criticize or praise right now, but I don’t think you can really get a read on this thing until all the pieces are in place. And that’s going to be five or six years from now.
mgolax makes a great point by the way. UM may not be tearing it up in recruiting yet, but the fact that JP was able to hire Lattimore as their offensive coordinator was a pretty major coup.
Mark my words…within 10 years, Michigan will be a Top 10 lacrosse program. Denver and Notre Dame are Top 10 caliber teams, and Michigan has several ‘structural’ advantages over those schools.
ND: Fairly strict/religious school, located in the middle of nowhere, big time college football credentials are largely based on the past
Denver: Located much further away from the east coast, not as highly-ranked (academically), no big time college football/basketball
OK this JP guy, his stuff is great to read and this is why I say he is in for a rude awakening(see below recent interview). He will now be competing on a level playing field? I think I know why I cringe when I read his comments. There is no real acknowledgement that he is going into an entirely different world with the program going DI. There is no humility or reality in his comments. We won at the club level so this will make us successful at DI and these club players are going to get the opportunity to shine at the next level(those kids shouldn’t be on the field next spring). Again he keeps referencing the success of the club and the current players as if it will have any relevance for a successful DI program. I love the other comment answering the question if UM can beat Ohio State? “Ohio State? Of Course” If he’s lucky it will be a close game 4 to 5 years down the road. There is talk of UM playing Ohio State in the Big House before the Spring inter squad football scrimmage, like Ohio State has done over the past few years. Hopefully its not 2012 or 2013 because a lot of Michigan fans will get their first look at this team and be sadly disappointed as Ohio State slaughters his club players. I have to say if this coach continues with kind of arrogance every team he plays for the next couple of years will make sure to embarrass his team, again he is not playing club teams, they will not let up. I am sure come next spring his little interview will be posted all over the Ohio State’s locker room and I sure there will be more.
The other thing that I cannot get over is who’s idea was it to even compete in 2012? Why would they start out this way? Again , I think it goes to the arrogance and lack of reality of the coach that this club team is just like a DI team “We can compete, our club players will shine at the next level” For the next 3 to 4 years I will bet the Marquette model has more success as those coaches understand the challenge ahead. They get it that it would be the wrong way to start by playing in 2012 with the handful of DI transfers and the freshman recruits. But you know what, I think that group of players would kill UM this year and next year.
So I will look forward to the UM nightmare for the next couple of years. I love you JP, please keep it coming. Can UM beat Ohio State – “Ohio State? Of course.” The laughs just keeping coming.
What does varsity mean in terms of difficulty? How do you predict your team will fare?
It’s a completely different level. As a club team, we were able to build our own resources and support that put us at the top of the pack. As a varsity program, we will be competing on a much more even playing field, and we’ll have a period of transition as we get there in recruiting, coaching, and facilities. We’ll get there, though. I can’t predict how we’ll fare right away, but I can promise that we will compete and that we’ll have a program that Michigan fans will be proud of.
For the uninitiated fan, what are the basics of how the game works?
Lacrosse is most like basketball strategically, with the contact of football or hockey. If a new fan thinks of it from a basketball perspective, they will understand it a lot faster.
What is the best thing about watching lacrosse?
Lacrosse takes a lot of strategy, skill, and teamwork, but it also allows for creativity. It’s high-scoring, action-packed, fast, and physical. What’s not to like?
What is the most confusing part for new fans?
When a shot goes out of bounds, the closest team to the ball when it crosses the sideline is awarded possession. This is only true for shots. It’s intended to reward teams for shooting by making it easier for them to retain possession.
Who are some U-M players to watch?
Trevor Yealy is a fifth-year attackman who was a four-year First Team All-American in the MCLA. He is a pure goal scorer who does so much for us on and off the field. Keep your eyes on Thomas Paras, a junior attackman, as well. He has the athletic ability to thrive at the D1 level. A lot of our club players will have tremendous opportunities to shine at the next level.
Who will U-M’s biggest rivals be? And can U-M beat Ohio State?
Ohio State, Notre Dame, and Penn State are natural rivals. I’m sure new rivalries will develop as we go forward as a D1 team and in our conference, the ECAC. Ohio State? Of course.
Hap, do you seriously believe that a team scrimmaging amongst itself (Marquette) for a year could really “kill” a team that will have a combination of a year of varsity and (for some) another year(s) of top-level club experience (Michigan)? We shall see in 2013.
Marquette and High Point are waiting until 2013 because they are starting from scratch. Michigan already had lacrosse infrastructure and players on campus.
I didn’t read it the way you did. I read the “level playing field” comment as saying – “we won at the club level because we were able to build huge advantages over everyone else. At the varsity level we won’t have that. We can’t build those same advantages. It will be much harder.” He’s also saying this is a great opportunity for these players. In effect, without calling his players out, he’s agreeing with you. They wouldn’t have had this opportunity without this situation.
Everything I’ve heard from the program is that JP wanted to wait a year to start, even with the foundation they have. They are starting this year because the AD decided that’s how it’s going to go. What’s he supposed to do? He has to agree publicly with his boss.
I guess it’s a matter of perspective. If you choose to rip the Michigan program, there will be plenty of opportunities to do so for the first few years. It’s an easy target. I doubt very much they are expecting their record to reflect how the program is doing for the first two or three years. Give it time.
He (very obviously) meant the “level playing field” comment as a disadvantage, rather than an advantage. It’s getting tougher and tougher to discern whether Hap is really dumb, or a really good troll.
As for the difference between waiting a year and starting now, this is the first I’ve heard that the AD pushed JP and co. into that start date. I think they wanted to reward the seniors who stuck it out, and wanted some senior leadership that had experienced success (albeit at the club level) and knew how hard you have to work to reach the summit.